I think what happened Just got blown out of proportion Welcome to another episode of SAYS Cakap Banyak Episode number 4 I’m still figuring out how to Sit in this podcast Because we have a new studio Well it’s not our studio It is a tattoo store/studio And being the last podcast We’re filimng for the year Let’s start off the new decade with a new topic What is the topic you ask? Well it’s kind of obvious We’re talking about tattoos today And with us, we have Julian Oh Julian Oh my God Nice to see you Julian Been there, done that Got a t-shirt Nice Okay, quick question Tattoo guy Why don’t you just introduce to everyone – Who are you
Your background Yup, cool I’m Julian Oh I’m a tattooer I’ve been tattooing for About 10 years And I am currently the co-owner of Wayang Kulit Tattoo Which is where we are right now Wayang Kulit Tattoo Tell us about Wayang Kulit Tattoo Like the shop When did it open? We opened about 3 years ago With my partner Joe We used to travel To Europe quite a bit And that’s how We met in Europe And As a Malaysian travelling together So, we shared a lot of ideas and stuff We did conventions in Europe together And one day we decided Hey, I think we should start a shop in KL And, we just waited for the right time And, we opened a shop 3 years ago Nice So Gwen, do you have tattoos I do not have any tattoos, but I’ve always wanted one I just like never fully committed to one I never did my research And then like In a few years Iʼll be like Oh ya, I really didnʼt want to get that tattoo And then like, I thought I wanted it So, I will get one Someday Maybe today, I donʼt know I canʼt get a tattoo My parents will disown me Yea Iʼm sure I mean Okay so, I mean The ruling, the fatwa The ruling in Islam, is that Tattooing is haram, because There are many reason why One of which I know about Is that you are kind of changing A physical appearance of yourself Which is a thing you canʼt do in Islam However, I have thought about if I would get a tattoo What I would get I watch a lot of Casey Neistat His tattoos are all dates – Dates, like kurma
So, it will be like 11th August Yea, heʼll type like Yusof Taiyoob Yusof Taiyoob So, it has like a date and wedding A date and daughterʼs birth Date, day I almost fell off a mountain Or like handwriting And thatʼs what you would get? Yea thatʼs what I would get, because Hereʼs the reason I think like if I get a piece of art on my hand, right It will be like, somewhere along the lines of Iʼm kind of So, either Iʼll love it Or Iʼll keep looking at it Until I find something wrong with it Then I start regretting it Maybe, maybe not Like maybe after 3 weeks, you might even Sort of forget that itʼs there Right, it just like disappears It just becomes part of your skin Ok, so for all of you who are in the know Especially if you follow news and all that So, I think just a few weeks ago There was a tattoo expo right here in KL 2019 So, from the tattoo scene point of view Like how important is this expo? I think it was pretty cool that There was a show in KL Of that size When I mean size, I mean like Having artist from all over the world International tattooers in a huge hall In KLCC Because I think in Malaysia, we are not really There yet, for shows Especially in Kuala Lumpur Thereʼs been a lot of- When you say not there yet Not enough shows? Or not enough exposure to tattoos in general? I think both I think itʼs definitely a growing mainstream scene As far as like shows and conventions are concerned So, I think to be able to finally do a show Of that big size and magnitude Thatʼs pretty cool I mean because Like for example, Singapore had their first show First like international tattoo show like 10 years ago So, weʼre sort of like 10 years behind in that sense However, weʼve had a few other smaller shows in KL Thereʼs been like some small tattoo events You know But a show of this size, yea Pretty cool, I think Thereʼs this one controversial issue that came about Itʼs mostly around the semi-nudity exhibition Okay, I donʼt know if you What do you think about that? Is it a good thing, is it a bad thing? Like to be honest I think what happened just got blown out of proportion Thatʼs all If you really look at it, it just got blown out of proportion Should it have happened? Maybe not But does this usually Is this something so strange in tattoo shows? Not really So It was just an issue That was like really blown out of proportion However, yea, maybe There could have been less? I donʼt know Itʼs… I mean These are not things that were planned Or done intentionally as well So… But they did get a permit for it They got a permit for the event But, okay, so what happens within the event Basically, wasnʼt like I mean, it is At the end of the day, it was also behind close doors So, itʼs a private event It’s a private event So, it does come into tug and war I feel of it Half of the people say that No, the event is permitted But they did not give a green light for Any kind of semi-nudity show case I don’t think there’s a permit for nudity – Anyway
I don’t think so You know what I mean So I think My take is that Regardless of whether That should have happened Or whether it was okay Or blah blah blah I think it’s just something that It just got blown out of proportion like super fast But in the context of a Tattoo expo right Tattoo exhibition You do definitely have people that like – For sure
Tattooed all the way up Okay, but if they can’t Showcase that in skin How can they showcase that? Like what could have been done instead? Would a picture on the wall be more offensive? – No
Or less offensive? I mean it’s totally different looking at a photo On the wall Compare to like The actual The art and craft on skin, you know Cause you really want to see how It really looks like in the flesh I don’t know, I mean Sure, there would be like A lot of At the end of the day What is done, is done But I guess moving forward This should This issue is Is actually a non-issue, I feel It should not be a hindrance to To continue Promoting or showcasing The tattoo industry in Malaysia Which means that It should not be Any reason for us to stop hosting Anymore tattoo shows and stuff in the future because I think It’s good to promote the scene, you know And I guess we just have to be A little more careful In the future Maybe a bit more Sensible or sensitive Do you think that this issue would have been like As big as it was If it was like in Singapore or something like that Or do you think it’s just like Because of our moral context here in Malaysia Possibly Yea I think that’s tricky too because like You know like Didn’t a minister come out and say that Tattoo culture is like not Malaysian culture And then, a lot of people got offended over that Whereas you would never hear such a thing like Being said overseas So But I think that whole thing about Malaysian culture Is weird, because There are a lot of things that are not Malaysian culture But people get into it as well So, I don’t think that is the I don’t think that’s a really strong Basis of argument for What happened, you know As I said, like I feel like eventually I will get a tattoo But I’ve done no research Absolutely no research whatsoever So, Julian help me out What should I look for, when like I think face tattoos man, like Like straight up, face tattoos Script on the forehead – Cool
Just put there Gwen Just put there damaged – It’s true
She’s a Part-time DC fan right here She hated the Suicide Squad movie I liked it more than others, but Yea, what’s the process like for me As someone who’s never gotten a tattoo Like should I be thinking of ideas Should I look into tattoo artist Hygiene wise Like in studios What should I look out for? Yea, take me through it Yea because like we’re both really new to this We both are non-tattoo people So, our knowledge is very much skin-deep Well we’re only barely touching the surface now Sorry, let’s just get to the point You’re sharp And colourful Thank you I had an inkling feeling to wear this This morning You’ve thought about this huh You woke up this morning Thinking a lot about this huh That is most of my nights I painted a picture in my head Okay, so I think All of the above Is true I think first and foremost you have to Want to get a tattoo In the beginning There are people who Feel that, okay ya Tattoos are cool, do I want it? Yea, maybe so I think you’re 50/50, you know Because I mean, it’s obviously Like a life long commitment, you know So Think hard about it And if you want to get a tattoo, then one foot is in And then, the next step is then to go If you really don’t know Who do you want to get tattooed from Or if you don’t know What style you like then You should go and do some research about it I think it’s safe to say that You would at least have One friend who’s tattooed And then you could ask about Experiences from the person And see But definitely, do your research It’s so easy to look for like The… – Yea
Instagram account Like styles Or tattooers on instagram And there’s plenty to choose from Especially in KL or Malaysia But the thing about the research right Are you researching What type of tattoo do you want? Or are you researching like Specific tattoo artist that you are looking for? I think just like music Sometimes you already know the genre That you want to listen to Then you are looking for artist within that genre And then sometimes, you are just looking for Music in general Just trying to see what you feel What you can vibe with you know So It’s similar with tattoos What you shouldn’t do is Go onto Google And type cool tattoos or Image search Cause we’ve seen like tons of people coming in and And just showing us a google picture And we know it’s from google And I think, the thing is a lot of people feel They need to put A meaning to the tattoo And that’s not wrong But I think some people try To put too much meaning to the tattoo And for example, they bring in a google photo that has Sometimes nothing to do with the meaning But then They try to put a meaning and it’s okay Cause you attach your own personal meaning To different things But we can see that, so We know like So, client like that who come in We actually do like a full consult and ask Like from the beginning, okay Forget all of this like What What do you want to get? And then, we talk them through the steps you know Ideation and then only Then we only talk about execution and stuff So, if You’re able to already start thinking like that Then, you’re one step further You know, you’re much Yea I like how you say consult Like this is a medical procedure Well Well, they are like piercing your skin It’s… I mean, yea, it is sort of a consult So, is this more of like a psychological consult Or do you Or is it like It’s more like a Motivational bring up your damage past Kind of consult As someone who’s about to go in and get a tattoo Do you need some kind of like Medical like, like So, like say, so No, it’s not that So, if Gwen wants to go in Does she need to show like a STD test Or something like that? Cause you are working with like Oh ya, for sure Like we want to see your whole Blood marker report, you know – Oh my God
We would like to see your insurance coverage as well Yea, birth certificate Family lineage Yea Are you messing with me? Or is this like Yup Yea I’m messing with you What the hell No, you don’t have to However, we have disclaimer forms That we require for you to fill up To state if you have certain Diseases or For example, even if you are pregnant now or Things like that cause we You can’t get tattooed While you’re pregnant, that’s pretty dangerous Is it because of metal poisoning or something like that It’s… We just don’t want to take the risk You know what I mean, it’s a life in there – It’s two lives
You know what would be good But amongst all of that, there’s a disclaimer form So, if you have any of these concerns Then it’s best to highlight it to us then We’ll decide if it’s ok Or whether we would like to take the risk In tattooing you Like for me right I’m really particular, like I’m kind of OCD About like hygeine So, I’m like What needs to be like What’s the proper set up? Because if I go in, I’m not going to know like You know, what’s clean or sanitary So, what do you think? That’s a really really good point And I think it’s a point that That most of The general public or clients Tend to overlook And it’s not because they I think sometimes they don’t know what they don’t know But it’s a good point, so First I think go to a reputable studio Because most of the reputable studios would Have already had – Yea
A more proper standard of hygeine I think sometimes you also use your feelings You know, you step into the shop You’ll know, you’ll know It’s very Star Wars You use your feelings Use your intuition Yea So, you step into the shop like You kind of know and, and You kind of have feel… and, and actually It is your right, to actually question the tattooers About how they run their hygeine So, for example Because you’re going to get tattooed and sometimes It’s your right to know, so you could ask Hey What are your hygiene guidelines here, like do you guys Use one time use needles? Do you have an autoclave? Do you Do you wrap your station up, you know Blah, blah, blah So, and if you feel like Taking a walk through To the working area You actually have the right to And I think tattooers should not be Insulted if that’s the case, yea That’s what like How I would feel I’ll be like I’m scared to ask you In case, I like insult you Yea Yea, for sure I think sometimes as Asians We are all a bit paiseh and stuff like that But no It is, you are right because If you get tattooed, all you need is one prick And Double edge sword there Yea – It is your right guys, don’t forget to ask
So So, I know that because It’s not such a mainstream thing There’s no like proper regulation There’s no like governing body But is there like a website or facebook page that People can go to check out, okay like Is there like a list of like Tattoo shops or whatever that people would think Oh this is actually A good tattoo shop vs a not good tattoo shop Is there such a thing? I don’t think there’s such a directory Because I think when you say a good tattoo shop It’s again, it’s so subject right, like Like We all do different styles, so… Like maybe, a certain artist is A certain artist is good in This style, that doesn’t Make this other artist who is not good in that style Any lesser so to speak so But in general, I think there are a few Popular shops in KL Shops that have been around Or ran by tattooers it’s been around for a long time So, you know they are the more Legit ones I guess Yea Okay, so Julian, what is your process And approach to like designing a tattoo Like as an artist yourself like Can you walk us through? Sure So basically, a client comes in And then Sits down for a consult with me We talk about tattoo ideas We talk about direction We talk about Subject matter So, sometimes clients would Already give me really cool ideas Like they would say Okay, I want this to be doing that And then like some background And then I try to form a visual Image in my head To see if it works Sometimes it does and it’s really cool And I see something and I go like okay, boom This is really cool And what we can do is like Okay, we do this, do this and this And then I might Also show Certain references and say yea Maybe like that Like so, if we already have like An idea And the subject matter down Then we can talk about execution But if we don’t have that Then we work on the idea first Once the client is really comfortable With the idea and the client buys his whole thing Then we go about, setting an appointment date And… For me In the back end I only draw really close to the appointment date So Because If you come for a consult with me And let say your appointment is in 2 weeks And I have like 2 weeks to think about it everyday Cause I look at references everyday I check out Drawing references Tattoo references and stuff like that So I have this mental image And I have a library in my phone So, something I can go back to So, I keep everything really fresh What I want to do, blah, blah, blah Till the really last minute And then I draw your piece You come into the shop On your appointment day I show you your drawing I show you how it looks on your body Cause when you look at a At a drawing on paper Sometimes you don’t get the full context It’s like flat Yea, so I show it to you on your body Okay, so this is how it is gonna look like Blah, blah, blah And if you want to make Small simple changes, that’s fine We can make the changes there and then And then you Go about and get your tattoo Do you like draw it on the skin first? – Like a sticker?
That’s, so that’s basically No, so we put a stencil So, we have like a Stencil of the tattoo design That we transfer onto the skin And then you would So, it’s basically all the outlines And then, you would get to see How it How it flows on your body And how it looks on your body Have you ever had someone like Completely not like the design at all Yea How do you fix it? Like how? I think This is the result of two things Either during a consult I got I misunderstood the client completely Or the client Sort of had a change of mind in terms of what they want And it’s ok It could be frustrating because You know, we set up an appointment today And we’ve already spent time drawing it And doing all that But at the end of the day The client is going to wear it for life so So, you got to – Accommodate
So, you got to just, you know accommodate You know As a tattoo artist, do you ever like Consult someone and be like – No, that’s terrible
You have to reject him – Yea, for sure
I’m sorry, I can’t do that or I can’t do you Or whatever Yea, if a client comes in And ask for super sensitive Political symbols or stuff like that I’m not going to do that, I don’t do I don’t do football club logos And there are a couple of thing I don’t do like Like for example I’ve got like 3 things that I absolutely can’t do I can’t do lions Lions why? Singapore? No I think it’s just, I don’t know It’s like my kryptonite In the case of lions Like dragons, like Like you know, Japanese dragons And Phoenix Phoenix? Woowwww Like you know, the big mystical bird Rise from the ashes So, those are the things that I really cannot do So, if someone comes in And wants to get that done I’ll go like sorry man I can’t do it Or if a client comes in And ask me to do something I’m not Comfortable with style wise You know, for example, it’s not something I do I do like a Sketch style traditional style but If someone comes in for Japanese I’m not going to do that If someone comes in for realistic portrait I’m not going to do that Cause it’s not something that I understand how to do And then I am not the best tattoo artist for you So, I rather recommend someone who is A lot better at that And you go to the person, you know Yea It’s the end, we’ve come to the conclusion of our show Okay Sorry Julian – Oh no
Got to kick you out now No don’t do that, okay Gwen’s ready – Okay, yup
Oh ya, let’s do that Okay, but all jokes aside, I think like Tattoos It’s not mainstream yet – It is
I fell like it’s not mainstream yet Do you think it’s going to get mainstream soon? I think, it is sort of already mainstream, for sure It’s just not as mainstream as Like a different country Okay, well, if you want to know more Julian, where can they check you out on like instagram? We’re on Instagram at Wayang Kulit Tattoo And on Facebook as well Or you can drop us an email at [email protected] Or you can drop by at SS15 Yes or you can come to the 47500 and check us out Okay guys, that’s all, hope you guys enjoyed this If you are thinking about your first tattoo Just give them a check out And then we’ll see you Next year, next decade – Oh my gosh
If you think about it We should get 2019 tattoos 2019 dash and then keep it empty Okay guys, I guess that’s it And bye, bye, bye

  1. I'm wearing henna tattoo to show off & I'm so proud of it tho it's not real, still loving it cuz as Muslim, I'm not allowed to.

  2. Guys, remember Sabah and Sarawak has this type of tradition of wearing tattoo. Don't misunderstood and says "Hey this is Malaysia, muslim country, cannot wear tattoo". Are you stupid or what? Malaysia is known to have different religion and culture, so any religion who forbid tattoo, then don't wear it.

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