Swedish Journalist Confirms Sweden Isn't a Socialist Utopia



hi everybody I'm bill little you know we hear so much of what a socialist utopia Sweden is we hear it every day from our liberal counterparts so we figured we'd see how right they are I'm very pleased to be joined today by Lars Anders Johansson who's a Swedish journalist he's a former political editor for the newspaper Asiata correspondent and he's also reported for Swedish TV for and SVT he now works with Tim bro it's a free-market organisation in Sweden he had a horrific trip coming over here 30 hours 25 hours and he thank you you look you look fresh as a daisy and thanks very much for being here Larsson thank you for having me there's a couple things I'd like to talk about Sweden Sweden in in America is held up by the progressive left as the kind of society that they would like America to be they want cradled very benefits they want all of the maternity leave they want they want they want the whole socialist package and you make the case that this is far from this idealized utopia that it's presented to us over here can you give us the the summary of how that works first of all conservatives like to think that Sweden's some kind of socialist nightmare that isn't the truth either because Sweden is very well functioning society and it is a lot of aspects but when leftists argue that Sweden functions well because of leftist policies Social Democratic policies during the last four or five decades I would argue that it's functioning well despite those policies because it was a functioning society long before that and I think it has to do with we have strong functioning institutions since centuries in Sweden and you can only have that in you can only have that kind of policy in a country that are so conformist as an hour it is perhaps the most certainly prior to this immigration way but Sweden seems to be the most socially cohesive society on the planet it's almost as samaa Janus as Japan is in a way prior again prior to the recent immigration waves and that sense of identity is what has made the Swedish socialism model as successful as it is that's not something that can be exported necessarily right I mean what you're basically saying is that it is that essential Swedish character that drives that social welfare state but that's not something that can be exported to the United States I think it's easier to implement that kind of social democratic policies in a very homogeneous society than in a diverse society yes correct one of the things I was reading for example is that is that in Finland which is also by the way I think that the Danish Prime Minister's said to Bernie Sanders stop using US interests as an example of socialism we're not socialists we're trying to make some money here but just as a little example I thought was a very telling example they said that one of the reasons that the social welfare state works well in Scandinavia is for things like there's a lot of automated trains and so on and that in America unions would simply just not allow this to happen they would you know they'd get involved they'd want the rates you know there is there's a there's a big fundamental difference between these two societies in terms of how this kind of thing could be implemented even if you wanted it to well Swedes tend to look at themselves or our selves as the most normal people on earth and all you are the people you are extremists so one way or another yes but when you look at for example the the World Values Survey you'll see that the truth is exactly the opposite Swedes are extremists in the way that we are the most secularized people on earth we are the most socially progressive people and so on so yeah it's kind of hard to implement the same policies on that kind of population and the diverse population like that in America well we are certainly seeing large changes in Sweden and all throughout Europe and so I kind of would like to to talk about some of these changes because it looks like this model of the perfect social welfare state is falling apart now if you just give me a moment I just said something up here my take is an American conservative would be that would be twofold that number one one of the reasons Sweden canceled Ford so many benefits for their people is because they don't have to pay for the kind of defense that can stop the Russians we're essentially American taxpayers are paying the bulk of Swedish defense from from what used to be the Soviet Union and the things are yeah saying this yeah so so you don't have to cover that kind of defense bill and that frees up more money but I think the main point is and this ties into the Islamic immigration issue is that a social welfare state is essentially a ponzi scheme you can have four people giving a little more of their income to support one person right and as long as the bottom of the pyramid continues to grow as long as the population continues to grow you can have create a little benefit cradle great benefits for the top but if your population is declining you can't have one person working to support four people for their entire lives and so therefore since the Swedish birthrate is well below replacement rates you have to import workers to keep the bottom of this socialist pyramid going and these workers have not really been assimilated very well is that a fair statement do you think first one word on the defense issue during the Cold War a cold war Sweden was one of the most militarized countries on earth I think on the fourth place or something per capita so during the most socialist years years the the Swedish government spent a lot on defense I stand corrected so but it's correct now that we spend almost nothing on defense and we are not able to defend ourselves so there the Finns they are quite angry about us because Sweden is a vacuum in the Baltic Sea region when it comes to defense policy but I don't think that has to do with the welfare state okay fair enough yeah so but the problem with the immigration is that it is immigration to welfare and not to jobs so I don't think that you are right that you need people to emigrate to keep them working in the socialist model because they are not working that is the problem that's the failure right I mean the idea would be certainly the idea at the beginning was we don't have a we have a declining birthrate we need new workers in order to keep these social benefits coming we need more people working at the bottom than we have at the top so these immigrants are brought in as workers but they're not only not working they're actually pulling resources out of the state and it seems like this is going to collapse fairly quickly actually I think that the immigration we see now are different it's different towards the immigration we saw during the 60s and 70s when workers came from Greece and Italy and from Finland and so on and almost everybody got a job immediately now it takes around seven years for half of the immigrants to get into the labor market and that has to do with we have a very regulated labor market in Sweden so those policies collide on the one hand we have this big welfare system and a regulated labor market on the other hand we have this open borders policy that every asylum seeker should get to Sweden but the system don't cooperate with each other let's talk about one of the things that you seem to specialize in and that's how some of these Swedish policies affect actual business we know for for in Europe certainly in and in countries like Sweden and even in France it's very very difficult decision to hire a person because once you hire them it's so difficult to fire them here in America if we have a boom we can take on some staff and if it slows down we just let them go and you know that's the way it goes so can you tell us a little bit about how the left-wing policies in Sweden have suppressed Sweden's economic growth and while it certainly appears to be a very egalitarian society would it not be a lot richer and wouldn't people be a lot better off if so many of these kind of legislative left-wing restrictions hadn't been put into place of course Sweden would be richer if people who get to Sweden till to live in Sweden got into the labour market as soon as they go there instead of living up the welfare systems so it's obvious we used to have here in America the lowest corporate tax rate in the world now I think we're number 24 or something it's cheaper to go to Ireland the tax in Ireland is lower than it is here how do you think that kind of heavy tax burden I think Denmark is the most heavily taxed highest tax rates in the world what does that do to business and innovation what does it do to the ability to not only produce jobs but to create entirely new industries well we had we have decreased the tax burdens during the last two periods of government but now I think they will raise it again because the system is is shaken right now so what was the question what what what do these policies do you know the the you were talking about it takes seven people to get seven years to get somebody in the labour force cause it's so hard to hire somebody because so hard to fire somebody and all the benefits how does that suppress wealth creation in Sweden well when the companies are ought to pay high taxes and they are afraid to hire people because they can't get rid of them when demand is shrinking well people don't get hired and then you've got those minimum wages that makes if low productive labour force they are not hired so if you are not very skilled then you won't get a job in Sweden and that's a problem when people come from from countries with low education and so on well as a voice for the free market and all of these economic individual liberties in Sweden what do you see in America that you find alarming because I wake up every day and I just you know I just want to jump off a bridge I mean everything in this country seems to be heading in a direction away from what made America such an economic dynamo do you see warning signs in America and what kind of things might you say to the American people in terms of because we're being sold that this is the way to go well the thing about regulations and centralization is that once you start it once you give away power to the government it's very hard to get it back and that is on the labor market and all other areas in society and so if you want to to keep to keep individualism and freedom then you should be very careful to give away individual power to the government yeah in the u.s. once a federal agency is is in place it becomes immortal NASA spent 14 billion dollars in 2006 and we were flying four space shuttles and they spent 14 billion dollars this year and we're not flying anybody it's a standing army it just never goes away the budgets just keep going up and more and more money goes into this hole and it's not used for investment it's not used to start new businesses it's not used for business loans it just goes sunk into these bureaucracies and it's just kind of a standing army of jobs for people who are pretty mediocre and you know it's a slippery slope as well back in the 70s which is considered like in the Golden Age of socialism according to the leftists in Sweden the Social Democratic government actually tried to impose a system where the government should buy shares in the major companies in Sweden so that and those shares should be given to the labor unions so eventually the labor unions were supposed to own the major enterprises in Sweden socialization of the of the market doesn't work very well in terms of competition does it it kind of stifles a lot of innovation it was such an extreme policy that the communist government in Yugoslavia turned it down but they tried to implement it it was like yeah Sweden is very conformist and we tend to had everybody in the same direction at the same time and the 70s was the most extreme century for unfortunately he turned around in the other half of the eighties but it's still a warning I think okay maybe we'll get shift gears a little bit and talk a little bit about some of the cultural things going on over there because American observers who are paying attention have noticed a sea change in European attitudes towards immigration within the last six months especially with this latest refugee crisis we're seeing things over here that we that we never thought we'd see you can't buy a gun in Austria every gun in Austria has gone off the shelves people are arming themselves they want borders now they're sealing borders within the European Union they're demanding they're demanding you know some kind of protection against this we hear that in Sweden a couple of these refugee centers were burned apparently Sweden from the outside I certainly don't mean to tell you what Swedes think that's why you're here but from from across the ocean here it seems to me that Sweden takes enormous national pride in their fairness their generosity their decency and their willingness to accept immigrants but these immigrants are not being assimilated into Swedish society and they are changing Swedish society and when we hear things over here that Sweden's become the rape capital of Europe and that and that the news will not report that the people that committed these crimes were Muslim immigrants or whatever the case may be do you feel that when the elites suppress what people know to be true there is a coiled spring in that every day the spring gets a little more strength behind it and then something something's going to change right it's very confusing to live in Sweden when the government you know one day says that there's no limit on the immigration we can take how many asylum seekers will come and just a few months later they are planning to close down the bridge connection to Denmark because they say that we didn't can't take it anymore the same government so they are they are not talking talking openly about what's going on that's true can you tell me what the this is this is actually the most of all the things over there this is the thing that interests me the most can you tell me what it's like for the average Swedish citizen who's been raised and whose national identity is immigration diversity multiculturalism this is a religion essentially it's it's essentially a religion that's been imbued in them from birth and at the same time they're being told that women probably shouldn't wear miniskirts address so provocatively and maybe you should together in groups isn't there got to be a kind of a cognitive dissonance between what you were told to believe what you want to believe versus what you're seeing on the street with this you know this rampant crime from a very small part of the population to understand the the Swedish view on multiculturalism you've got to understand the ideological foundation because the authorities since the 70s has promoted the idea that the Swedes and the immigrants have an equal responsibility to integrate into the new society that will occur in the future which is a multicultural society it's the summer same idea is in Great Britain and Germany I think but that doesn't seem to be working out so well but these people don't seem to be integrating on the contrary and of course as we need to say if we say in this country as well we're not talking about the vast majority of people who are peaceful hard-working people come there but there is a large immigrant radicalized Muslim immigration problem in Europe and starting here as well they're not talking about integrating they're not talking about merging to form some new society that nobody looks like they are calling for Sharia law they're calling they have a cultural norm that says well you know if you if you rape somebody and she's a Kafar well she was asking for it she wasn't wearing a burqa this is not certainly this cannot be what Sweden had in mind when they started this process we've got big problems with segregation in Sweden ethnic segregation economic segregation with large areas around the big cities where people are living outside of the labour market and in some aspects in outside the society so yeah and people who are not getting in touch with the labour market they are have no jobs how how could they integrate into society it's a big problem so yes what do you think the future is going to be in terms of this trend if it continues didn't I believe I heard the switch ministers say during the recent set of riots and and he basically said this can't continue that this that this is destroying the country where do you think it's gonna go well we have to find a way to get those people to to get jobs because it won't work do you think it's just a jobs issue no it's not just a jobs issue but without jobs nothing will change and then we have the problem I don't know have you read Paul Colliers Exodus the book about migration no I haven't read about it yeah we've got the diaspora problem that when you you've got another diaspora with great cultural differences from the majority it tend not to integrate into society and the larger the differences between the diaspora for example the Somali diaspora and the majority is a majority and society the harder it will get to integrate and the larger it get you know largely the Diaspora gets the harder to integrate and it will continue to grow because people bring over their relatives of course yeah I'd like to get your take on something the the European progressive multicultural model is the idea that you could set up a country where everybody brings in their own ethnic groups they stay in their own ethnic groups they aren't one new culture there there's a Muslim population there's an Irish population whatever and they all live together in peace and harmony this doesn't seem to be working anywhere in the world the American model is almost the exact inverse of that the American model says if you are willing to come here and renounce your not only your former citizens citizenship but renounce your former animosities if you're gonna have a pizza shop and you're an Indian and you've got a guy next door who's got a shoe store he's a Pakistani we don't expect you guys to be at war with each other over here you're new people here now this melting pot idea is the antithesis of multiculturalism it says yes by all means bring the flavours of it but we all agree that we're going to form a society and the core conservative belief and I think the core American belief is if a person comes here legally and they passed the citizenship test and they raise their right hand they are as American as somebody who got off of the Mayflower but that's the problem with combining combining and well the big welfare system with open borders because migration to welfare won't lead to integration in society that's right but migration to jobs will do exactly that's right it's a difference between a refugee and an immigrant an immigrant makes a decision to give up the old life in order to come to a place that they want to live and adjust to that new society while refugees whether political economic are people who are basically just running but they're bringing their old values with them and they're looking kind of for a handout yeah and that's that won't work in the future I don't think so either final question for you what do you think the future of the European Union is going to be there there was just a year or two ago with the Greece you know default there was enormous financial pressures on the EU and in a short form that the Germans don't want to work their tails off in order for the Greeks to sit around on the beach and there's an enormous economic problem but with this most recent wave of immigrants there is now a sense of closed borders between these European states do you think the European Union has a future well it depends on which direction it takes because the European Union has for some decades now been moving towards some kind of big welfare state I don't know if you have heard about the agricultural policy 40 percent of the EU budget goes to subsidize it goes to subsidize agriculture in the European countries and I think if that will continue we will see more examples like that in in Greece the free movement inside the Union and the inner market are great achievements and unfortunately I think we will see the end of those achievements soon with border controls on everything and if that happens I'm afraid that it would be not I don't think the European Union will have a future yeah if you can no longer if you can no longer get on a train and in in Calais and and ride to Great Britain because immigrants are going down the tunnel and you have to basically stop then it's no longer a it's no longer a federal union in the way the United States is I don't have to stop at the border with Arizona in order to get to Arizona that's a it's a whole different set of problems well ours Anders it's been absolutely enlightening and it's always good to know there are people over there who who have a different view over things and and it's been a pleasure hearing your viewpoints here today thanks for joining us thank you for having me well we'll continue to tell you things that the mainstream media doesn't here at PJTV so for everyone here at PJTV I'm bill Whittle thanks for watching we'll see you next time




Comments
  1. @11:50 : Yes, socialism is bad because you'll have mediocre people in jobs; mediocre until it is time to fight a war then everyone is super able and the best fighting force in the world.
    Give me a break.

  2. I'd rather see income recirculating through and ever widening section. Call redistricting, call it recirculating call it redistributing ; question is, is money your property or the govt property? Read your notes.

  3. It's obvious the European countries let things get way out of hand after World War II when it comes to immigration and multiculturalism. There is a middle ground that they should have found and I can't believe it's taken so long for them to realize this. It's not too late to start letting as many white people come to your country is possible

  4. With all due respect why did it take so long for these countries to realize what was happening? It's just common sense and math when you're letting all these people from other countries come in

  5. After World War II Europeans went exactly in the opposite direction from Nazism because it was politically correct and that has come back to haunt you. There is a middle ground and that's where Europeans made their mistake

  6. Lars made a fool out of Whittle and Whittle didn't have a clue. What Lars is saying is that implementing the mixed economy and social values of Sweden in a conservatively racist minority and liberal majority United States is very difficult to do, if not impossible. Sounds like a good idea to me especially if we can stop the election theft continually perpetrated by the conservatives and red states. Only then will be stop this tryanny by the minority that we have been experiencing since Reagan and the conservatarian globalists with their free trade free market trickle down scam.

  7. Socialism in the USA is a run away freight train! The massive growth and cost of our government is also a run away freight train. These factors "will" destroy our work driven economy! As the private sector income taxes will eventually "not" be enough to pay for either since they cost side is faster growing than the private sector side! Duh,,, means duh!

  8. I was on holiday recently and spent a lot of time with a group of Swedish golfers who where staying in the same hotel as me and my GF. They where all of same mind regarding immigration. Whilst they had no problem with limited immigration they could see the damage being done to their country. I am not talking about people with nationalist ideas. These guys were all pretty liberal in their views. They were relatively well educated, business owners and others with good jobs. One was an ex-officer in the Swedish army until his regiment was disbanded. He also spent several years as UN inspector in the Lebanon. They were all in agreement that their country was being destroyed from within and that unless there was a drastic rethink their country would be in a complete mess and beyond recovery in the not too distant future.

  9. I'm a swede, I can confirm that Sweden is going of a ledge and Muslims are at the bottom to take over the country. Right now the only hope is the Swedish democrats, mark my words if Sweden collapses within the next three years

  10. This guy seems like he has accepted his and his country's fate. He agrees that a combination of refugees, open boarders, and a welfare state leads to disaster, yet, rather than stopping the flood of refugees and dismantling the welfare state, he would rather stick to his belief that it can work if only there were more jobs, or if Swedes would assimilate with the refugees, or if (insert excuse here)… It's madness and very troubling. Sweden is a country that feels tremendous guilt about being mostly homogeneous and is now trying to correct that by importing a ridiculous amount of refugees at once. Has western society gone fucking bananas?

  11. It is statistically unfair for us leftists to keep making comparisons to microstates that have one urban center (many of which are still monarchies). France, Germany, and Russia are the comparable models.

  12. so socialism only works when the country has alot of success before the country was socialist
    so you have to first have a bunch of rich people for it to work

  13. Europeans have lost their pride in the true European identity, the indigenous people who were there since the beginning and who built the land and culture in to historical greatness. And because of this stupid white-hate tolerance of 3rd-worlders, the people will be breed out and every European country will become an impoverished hell-hole. The people are what make a place a good place to live, and uneducated, violent leeches are coming.

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